Friday, September 26, 2008

Search Engines And Your Website

We are officially in Web 2.0. In fact, if you're on the bleeding edge, you are currently doing your research on the emergence of Web 3.0 - and it's coming. You know that because when magazine covers are touting Web 2.0, it's already arrived many many months earlier, if not years.

Ok, so, your most important marketing tool is your website. That's a given. Really. And you probably submitted it to the search engines (Google, Yahoo, and MSN), and you either are "found" for your search terms, or you're not. When you're found, and then all of a sudden, you disappear, you panic. For me, my website represents two to six assignments a month, on average, and that is a substantial amount of money, so I pay careful attention to where I rank on the search engines, but not all search engines are equal, and what happens on one doesn't happen on another. That applies to successful strategies to be "found", as well as what happens when you disappear.

I've written several times about this - It's Google's World, You're Just A Small Part of It, as well as SEO - Wild Wild West or Reason & Logic?, but I want to take this even further.

Why does this happen?

(Continued after the Jump)

When your ranking drops, 90% of the time it's because of a SE changing it's methodolgy for ranking sites. They are doing this because they believe it is in the best interests of their users. Some people refer to this as moving the goal posts, others refer to it as a "Google slap."

Interestingly enough, this has just recently happened. Over at (here) , they are reporting people with BluDomain websites having lost SE postions just last month. So too, some liveBooks clients have experienced this. Yet, this problem is not related to either of these companies specifically, because I have spoken to over a dozen photographers in the last week that don't have BluDomain, LiveBooks, or Clickbooq sites, and they too have experienced a drop in their positions. This is a global issue, and not related to anyone service provider. For some who report having a problem last month they are now back where they were. For others, the wait and the concern continues.

Let's first pull together some resources about search engines.

First - has your site that was on Google been banned? Check on all of the three SE's. simply type in your web address -, (and also try it without the "www") and see if it's there. If it is there, then you're ok. If not, let's discuss further.

Uptime - many inexpensive web hosting companies have significant downtimes. If your host was down during a Googlebot visit, thats probably part of the problem. Answer: Get a new provider.
Mirror sites - if you have mirrored your site, it may be that they are seeing duplicate content on other domains, and favoring (or dis-favoring) that site instead. Duplicate sites also give them cause for concern about spamming.

Tricks - don't be an idiot and do white text on a white background. That trick is so 1999. All the SE's know that, and every other trick you can think of. Don't do black hat or even grey hat tricks.

Inbound links - trading links with someone is considered a grey hat trick. Google knows what you're up to. You need inbound links without a return link. When you think you can do it by doing circular links, they have caught on to that too. Avoid link farms - too many outbound links on one page is a link farm. Avoid these, the SE's don't like them either.

Or, perhaps you are concerned about your ranking dropping. That happens. Get used to it. When you ease up on your SEO efforts, it's like stopping doing your mailings to prospective clients. Don't rest on your Page 1 laurels. Keep at it. It should be what you do in the evenings during commercial breaks of your favorite TV shows, or when you're waiting for a client to call you back.

Google, for example, has a "sandbox", (also insights here Search Engine Guide - How To Play In Google's Sandbox ) and it's there that they put sites that are less than six months old. Google wants you to earn your way out of the box. During this time, Google is looking to see if other sites are linking to you.

Let's talk for a minute now about inbound links. Since Google is the big dog, we'll use them. Inbound links come and they go. They also are relevant one day, and less so the next. For example, let's say that a SE considered the John Smith website a white hat site, and he had a link to you. Then, for some reason, his site dropped in ranking, possibly because of grey hat tactics, or perhaps because he was seen as a link farm (pages become suspect after there are about 20 links or so on a single page). If his site rating drops, so too (potentially) does the value of that link to you. Guilt by association.

To check out who has inbound links to you, search "", and also search "". Both give you insights into how Google sees you. Of most importance is the "+" search. That's called a "character search", and those are often links of significantly less value than the ones that return under the "link:" search.

Does your website have a sitemap? Sitemaps are very helpful for the SE spiders. Rob Haggart over at, who has a companion site -, where he talks about his commitment to SEO (SEO Of Our Websites) gives you a great deal of excellent information. So too does liveBooks (Search Marketing ).

I also want to encourage you to check out San Diego photographer Robert Benson's blog where he compares the main website providers - Photographer template websites compared . Google has a Website Optimizer, and this link (Website Optimizer Activates Pruning, Modifies Reports, and More
) talks all about it. Further, one of my regular reads is Search Engine Watch, and they have a great piece titled "Ready to Finally Try SEO?" that is well worth a read. Another piece on Search Engine Watch is "Experts - au Natural" about organic search results that's a great read.

Let's return to inbound links. (Are you getting the clue that they are the current key to SE success?) SE Watch has "Experts - Link Love" with recent/timely pieces on link popularity. Consider this too - when someone searches and finds you, regardless of the SE, their IP address is colllected by the SE, and when you - recognized by the IP address, comes BACK and does another search, or clicks on a different link, that is a mark against you - as defined by actual SE users. Search Engline Land wrote about this as it relates to changes in paid placements, and it talks about the change as a result of a "Previous Query". ( ""Previous Query" Refinement Coming To Hit Google Results" . This is the kind of intelligence that Yahoo, with their human-created search results from the late 90's and early 2000's, couldn't scale up, but none-the-less produced very valuable results. This is the basis for the benefits of inbound links. On top of that, back in July, SE Watch wrote about User Intent - "Google On User Intent in Search Queries" () when they said ""Search in the last decade has moved from give me what I said to give me what I want.""

Next up - just a week or so ago, SE Watch interviewed one of Google's Directors, in charge of engineering, about the nuances of search. This piece is incredibly valuable to read, because it comes from the mouth of the search gods themselves - Google Discusses Search Evaluation Process (9/16/08). Back in 2007, Webmaster World had a dialog about the constant changes by Google - termed "Everflux" , (Frequent Change in Google Search Results - almost hour by hour) and also addresses how you can be found in once search result done on the East Coast, and in a different position on the West Coast, as it relates to the changes in the content in their data centers. Everflux, and other people experiences that demonstrate that this is not a new phenomenon can be found here - (Disappearing and Reappearing rankings - Everflux or something else? ).

In fact, Google themselves wrote a piece on their official blog about two weeks ago (Search evaluation at Google, and is a piece written by the same engineering director above, Scott Huffman. Huffman has written a must-read piece on this subject. In part, he writes:

Evaluating search is difficult for several reasons.
First, understanding what a user really wants when they type a query -- the query's "intent" -- can be very difficult. For highly navigational queries like [ebay] or [orbitz], we can guess that most users want to navigate to the respective sites. But how about [olympics]? Does the user want news, medal counts from the recent Beijing games, the IOC's homepage, historical information about the games, ... ? This same exact question, of course, is faced by our ranking and search UI teams. Evaluation is the other side of that coin.

Second, comparing the quality of search engines (whether Google versus our competitors, Google versus Google a month ago, or Google versus Google plus the "letter T" hack) is never black and white. It's essentially impossible to make a change that is 100% positive in all situations; with any algorithmic change you make to search, many searches will get better and some will get worse.

Third, there are several dimensions to "good" results. Traditional search evaluation has focused on the relevance of the results, and of course that is our highest priority as well. But today's search-engine users expect more than just relevance. Are the results fresh and timely? Are they from authoritative sources? Are they comprehensive? Are they free of spam? Are their titles and snippets descriptive enough? Do they include additional UI elements a user might find helpful for the query (maps, images, query suggestions, etc.)? Our evaluations attempt to cover each of these dimensions where appropriate.

Fourth, evaluating Google search quality requires covering an enormous breadth. We cover over a hundred locales (country/language pairs) with in-depth evaluation. Beyond locales, we support search quality teams working on many different kinds of queries and features. For example, we explicitly measure the quality of Google's spelling suggestions, universal search results, image and video searches, related query suggestions, stock oneboxes, and many, many more.

If you really want to understand SEO, and your SERP, then you need to read EVERY link in this piece, and follow the links on those pages. Understand that grasping SEO, and doing it right, will be one of the most profitable things you can do to grow your business. I have not steered you wrong here. These are exceptional and highly respected sources. Ignore SEO at your own peril. Resting on your SEO laurels is akin to knowing the benefits of SEO and then ignoring them - it's a dereliction of duty to yourself and your success.

Please post your comments by clicking the link below. If you've got questions, please pose them in our Photo Business Forum Flickr Group Discussion Threads.


Patrick Baldwin said...

Great posting John but can you explain white, grey and black hat tricks to somebody who knows jack about this but is just about to read EVERY link as you so rightly suggest.
Regards. Patrick.

Colby McLemore said...

Great post. I'm starting to try to wrap my head around this. It is much more amorphus than I would like. Thanks for somme clearity....I think.

Andy Smith said...

This is very helpful, thank you John there's a huge amount of information there.

I'm a Livebooks customer and am in the process of experiencing this. If there is anybody reading who is in the same boat, please explain what's been happening, I'd be very interested to learn about what's going on with other people's sites. After months of hard work and expense I'm over the frustration of my site dropping from page one and am now trying to answer the most important question; where do I start building it all up again?

My site dropped from position one of page one to nowhere for searches in my local city for one day, then it reappeared. The following week it dropped again for a longer period of time, then reappeared again in position one. Now it's been gone for even longer and I fear for good.

Is anybody else experiencing anything similar?

Thank you again for the links and information John.
Andy Smith.

Ken Lopez said...

Excellent post, John! How on earth do you find the time to keep up on all of this???

BTW LOVE what LiveBooks does in terms of SEO, but IMO their website design needs an overhaul. I've seen plenty of other sites that resize images with the current screen resolution, to the point where it's becoming the new norm for photographic websites.

750 x 500 pixels on a 24 inch widescreen monitor that has a resolution of 1900 x 1200 doesn't stand a chance.


Mark Scheuern said...

Andy, my LiveBooks site has taken a major hit recently, too, I assume because of changes at Google, though some non-LiveBooks sites haven't budged. I wish I knew what was going on. There's a discussion of this going on at SportsShooter:

It's interesting that you've seen your site bounce around so much since the initial big drop. I haven't noticed that with mine but perhaps I've missed seeing it.

Ken, I agree. I'd like to see a bump in image size for the various levels at LiveBooks.

I should also add that, in general, I couldn't be happier with LiveBooks. Great service, easy to use, and, until very recently, excellent ranking. It's been well-worth the money.

Andy Smith said...

Likewise Mark, other sites that appear and always have appeared next to mine are still there.

Livebooks have been great since I contacted them about it, they can't do enough to help. Be good to find out wether it's a long term thing or wether it might return to "normal" after a while though.

It's very frustrating having invested time and money to see it disappear like that. If I hear or discover anything new I'll post it here.


bryan heu, ceo said...

For the record, clickbooq sites are not [yet] affected that we know of, however we do have our own conclusions as to what caused this to occur and are closely monitoring this issue. Also, I am not aware of any other services besides Livebooks that this is an issue with.

John Harrington said...

Bryan --

This isn't about any one service, yours, LB's, or Blu's - I noted a link where Blu sites are being affected, and also it's worth noting (as referenced in the link above) that some LB sites have returned.

-- John

bryan said...

Thanks, John. But the problem with the LB's sites aren't that they're are losing rank, but that they are actually being de-listed from Google. When a site is no longer turning up in results and the only way they can be found is by the search 'site:', that means it's been de-listed. Perhaps (and I hope), that it is a Google fluke and that everything will return to normality soon, but the fact that sites are returning to being listed is probably more due to the fact that they've likely been resubmitted to Google/site mapped, etc. and Google has finally gotten around to indexing them again, which generally seems to take about 3 weeks or so based on what we've seen.

Andy Smith said...


Nobody was trying to point a finger in one direction or another, Mark and I just happened to be experiencing a similar problem. I've read other forums and people with a variety of site designers have said the same thing and whoever the design company is, is off the point.

Surely it's Google just doing what they do and Googling around isn't it? That's perfectly understandable, as John commented in this post - "perhaps you are concerned about your ranking dropping. That happens. Get used to it." [although I have to say a heads up that something was changing would be nice]. Nobody is suggesting anybody is responsible for anything because there's nothing really to be responsible for.

More importantly from my own personal point of view, as I mentioned in my original comment, it's not the fact that it's happened that bothers me, I'm over it. The issue now is where can I find information about how to change my SEO strategy in order to align my site with Googles change of direction.

It was of course a hypothetical question, because if anybody knew the answer this post wouldn't exist.

All good.

bryan said...

Absolutely, Andy. All good. I just hope that if/when it happens to our sites, our users will be as understanding. Cheers.

andy ptak said...

Another Livebooks guy here whose site fell of the face of the earth. I even ponied up another couple of grand for their SEO partner at engineworks in Oregon.

After they did their magic a few months ago, my ranking came from nowhere to page one and I was very happy. Over the last few weeks I'm back to nowhere and we're trying to find what's up.

It's more than frustrating, it's depressing. Even if/when this gets fixed it's going to take Google many months to give me a decent ranking.

Almost all of my traffic these days are from referring sites and links from blogs like this. People want to see who this loud mouth is, I guess.There is virtually no traffic from organic search.

John - while I'm on that subject, you state that you can often count on a couple of jobs a month that came from a search of your site because it's out there working for you 24 hrs a day. Is that because of your specialty/location, because I rarely find that someone found me from a search that coughed up my site.

Eric said...

great post John. thanks again for all the info.
More about web 3.0 sometime......?

John Harrington said...

Andy P-

I always ask prospective new clients "who can we thank for the referral, and when they say "online" I then ask "oh, what search engine?" and then I ask "just out of curiosity, because I am always wondering- what did you search for?". These questions reveal that many but not all are coming from Google, and let's me know how I am doing.


Andy Smith said...

Thought this might be of interest.

Having been away all week my LB site is now back on top [Saturday]. Page one and position one for one of my local search terms and page one position two for another.

'editorial photographer leeds' and 'commercial photographer leeds' respectively.

It disappeared and returned a few times before so I can't be sure if it will stay there but hopefully this is the end of it.

Interestingly, it appears to go back to the top on a weekend and then disappear through the week. Don't know if that means anything.

Interesting post, thanks to all [particularly LB] and here's to problems solved.


Emile Wamsteker said...

@ andy smith's and bryan's posts

I experienced a similar problem a few weeks ago with my LB site; it completely vanished from Google's radar screen. This made me realize how much I'd taken for granted that my LB site always came up as the #1 ranking when doing a search on my name.

It never really became a serious issue for me, however, since I was able to reconcile the problem within 48 hrs.

I can't say for sure what did the trick, but I went into my Livebooks edit suite and played around with their SEO tools and added keywords to my site, which I'd never done prior to this. I also re-registered my website with Google. After doing some research on SEO, I set up a Google analytics account, and Google webmasters tools account, both of which are free. Google analytics provides amazing data on visits to your site, drilling it down to the amount of time a visitor spends on a given page. You have to provide code from your site to Google in order for them to analyze your site. The folks at LB sent me a "how to" email, which was very helpful.

Within a couple of days, a google search on my name yielded my LB site as the #1 ranking once again. I haven't seen this change since I made the tweaks to my site.

I think it's important to note that this is not a problem specific to Livebooks. BluDomain and photographers with independent hosting are experiencing the same issues.

The positive side of seeing your SE ranking drop is that it raises your awareness of SEO, and how important it is. In addition to the zillion other workflows I have going in my business, I have a new one--SEO.

All the best,

-Emile Wamsteker

Andreya padty said...

Hi Nice Blog .When you are getting on with a blog site and choose to use it to network, build networks and link, then it's essential that you make it competent and able so that it can stand the test of time. For a site to be successful it's essential that it does not fade away in SEO training.

Marc Fuller said...

It is almost impossible for any site using a typical flash splash page to get good general search indexing. It is a little difficult just to keep them in the search index at all.

Why? First they they use a flash splash page which has little in the way of useful content. As pretty as it may be, for the search engine it is just a site name and description tag, with maybe a duplicate of the description tag text near the foot ... that is about it.

Secondly, almost all flash template sites use javascript menu links which cause Google to not add the linked pages to its index. So Google often interprets your site to be potential spam; a splash page of mostly flash and javascript links with very little relevant content ... often causing it to be removed from the index.

If you want it to consistently be in the index at all, you need to place a little more content that assures Google that your site has some useful information related to your name. The content needs to be visible to the visitor and not attached to any script. It can be short but should include your name or business name and location, phone and a brief description of your business/services. Just the minimum of what you would expect Google to return if a long lost relative was looking for you and wanted to know if they had found the right "person".

Welcome to any thoughts.








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sex said...









博倒 said...







Anonymous said...

^^ nice blog!! ^@^

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Anonymous said...

^^ nice blog!! thanks a lot! ^^

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