tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7553278593406733377.post2703322065266255802..comments2024-03-20T00:37:30.189-04:00Comments on Photo Business News & Forum: Lessig's Kool-Aid: Proposed New Norms - Don't DrinkJohn Harringtonhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/16941161605443479300noreply@blogger.comBlogger9125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7553278593406733377.post-46461972255424647102010-10-26T11:45:23.455-04:002010-10-26T11:45:23.455-04:00You people are insane. Lessig is talking about ama...You people are insane. Lessig is talking about amateur creativity. He isn't saying steal other people's work and sell it.<br /><br />check out this image:<br />http://www.feross.org/wp-content/uploads/2009/08/lessig2.png<br />"The ideal copyright scenario, after Lessig’s suggested reforms have been implemented. He proposes that amateurs be allowed to remix and modify copyrighted works without limit (free use). Only professional copying is off-limits. The “grey areas” are left up to the copyright owner to decide"<br /><br />Seeing as how this is the "Photo Business & News Forum," I would guess everyone on here falls under professional creativity.greghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10505201849043035128noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7553278593406733377.post-83801245979043139312010-10-19T12:27:25.893-04:002010-10-19T12:27:25.893-04:00Let's expand Mr. Lessig's belief about usi...Let's expand Mr. Lessig's belief about using underlying ownership of an entity and remixing it for use by another, but use his credit card as an example and see how he feels then. <br /><br />Let's take the number off his plastic VISA card and remix it onto a generic order form -- giving him full credit to the number's authenticity, his name, security code, etc. -- and we as the new legal owner of this remix we start ordering anything we want. <br /><br />Using the same principle where we as photographers lose control and money over the use of our image ownership, now Mr. Lessig loses control and money over the use of his CC ownership. Sounds fair, don't you think?Doug Pizacnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7553278593406733377.post-64546726348232825592010-10-19T10:15:43.933-04:002010-10-19T10:15:43.933-04:00Gregg -
It's troublesome that you persist in...Gregg - <br /><br />It's troublesome that you persist in going off half-cocked and continuing to try to make this point. If you had done the research, you'd know that Boston Market and Donato's are brands owned by McDonalds.<br /><br />And, to your larger point - inspiration and good ideas are contributory to future creativity, but the theft of someone's embodiment of their creativity, in still photograph, etc, is where it's wrong. Further, courts have held that buildings are not copyrightable, and, while a painting in the background of a hotel room is likely insufficient to trigger a viable copyright infringement case, on many occasions I have had movie studios contact me to get the right to use my images as set dressing in just that way. However, these are far and away different from the remix mentality, and I think you know that. <br /><br />- JohnJohn Harringtonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16941161605443479300noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7553278593406733377.post-11626796898758589752010-10-18T14:48:28.209-04:002010-10-18T14:48:28.209-04:00TO: John
That explains the McDonalds images, but ...TO: John<br /><br />That explains the McDonalds images, but what about those images from Boston Market and Donatos?<br /><br />John, my larger point is that all of our work stands on the shoulders of other creatives such as architects, clothing designers or painters. Whether it be the building interior we shoot in or the suit that is worn by a subject or the paintings in the background of a hotel room. These are the creative product of others and we never ask permission or share the income that their piece of the image provides.<br /><br />I suspect that if I had a stock images that included one of your images in the background I would probably hear from you... or your attorney. Just sayin'.Gregg Zivneynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7553278593406733377.post-76139749666445875142010-10-18T13:28:04.918-04:002010-10-18T13:28:04.918-04:00TO: Gregg Zivney
Sure Gregg - I was working on co...TO: Gregg Zivney<br /><br />Sure Gregg - I was working on contract for McDonalds, and everything was handled appropriately - by McDonalds corporate. <br /><br />-- JohnJohn Harringtonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16941161605443479300noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7553278593406733377.post-48040236916407499752010-10-18T12:56:18.696-04:002010-10-18T12:56:18.696-04:00John, thank you so much for your well thought out ...John, thank you so much for your well thought out response to the insanity that Lawrence Lessig is proposing. Advocating widespread infringement by "re-purposing" creative works is asking for trouble. We still photographers have a tough enough time protecting our work, without people such as Lessig proposing widespread theft of intellectual property. Thanks for speaking out against the madness.rudevalley; musings on the rudeness of Silicon Valleyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18347901933168751077noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7553278593406733377.post-50847625280492075612010-10-18T12:22:03.093-04:002010-10-18T12:22:03.093-04:00John, I appreciate your righteous indignation of ...John, I appreciate your righteous indignation of “using someone elses' creativity which they have transformed into intellectual property”. That said, would you please explain your image here:<br />http://www.johnharrington.com/dc-photographer-gallery/commercial-photography#id=album-3&num=1043<br />This image by John would be nothing without the creative effort of other photographers. I would be interested in learning how John contacted the photographers, the fees that were paid to license these images in his work and how he intended to credit their work in his work.<br /><br />John? John, are you there?Gregg Zivneynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7553278593406733377.post-8300326455270058272010-10-18T09:23:50.565-04:002010-10-18T09:23:50.565-04:00Mr Lessig, you make me feel ill:
You have said: &...Mr Lessig, you make me feel ill: <br />You have said: "...acknowledge and respect the people we're building upon by saying it's this person's work I am using, and thank you for creating that work, but I'm not asking permission to remix that work."<br /><br />So may I use your car, your home, your wife, would that be OK if I merely acknowledge that they're yours? Of course, "I won't be asking permission". Oh no, I forgot one thing, you didn't create them. <br /><br />So, Mr Michelangelo, Mr Da Vinci, Mr Monet, Mr Disney, is it cool for me to 'remix' (Yeccch, this term needs to be banned) your work and claim it as my own when I have finished diminishing and distorting it? Fine to make money from it?<br /><br />Puh-leez, Mr Lessig, get a grip - your notions are thoroughly offensive to people who actually CREATE, but I guess you wouldn't sympathise with that as you are obviously advocating THEFT, and have probably never created anything more than concern in others.<br /><br />May I please remind you that many many people derive income on which they depend from controlling their own creations and IP, and by advocating repurposing or remixing you are implying a massive lack of respect: NO you may not remix my work, and if I catch you at it I will hunt you down. I do hope you will sink without trace really quite soon.Nick Meersnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7553278593406733377.post-74943046173387486962010-10-18T05:29:26.051-04:002010-10-18T05:29:26.051-04:00So...according to Lessig...it's ok to take som...So...according to Lessig...it's ok to take someone else's work and "be upfront" about it if you credit them 'at the end of the credits, somewhere deep down' - hardly upfront in my opinion. Additionally, he wants re-mixers to have rights to the work they've re-mixed yet it's okay to take the work of others to do so...contradictory isn't it?<br /><br />I don't think Lessig has any understanding of how the creative process works and what it involves - his grasp is limited to a 'cut-and-paste' culture of appropriation and legitimised theft...historically, of course, that's always happened...an idea 'borrowed'...it's worrying that he advocates 'teaching' both culture and the law how to be...aside from the fact that neither are sentient beings, the notion that one should be able to proscribe what culture is smacks of dictatorship.Nick Dunmurhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09855200528825754161noreply@blogger.com